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Post by Figgles on Aug 11, 2021 17:31:23 GMT
What it is, is a perceivable...a stain....an empty appearance only!
"Unique" is an idea that hinges upon "others/many." That's your clue right there that there is no existence to "a unique, sensory perspective." All direct sensing, the sense of being a something that perceives, just another appearance within the dream...empty and devoid of inherent existence.
"Singular/only One," is saying something different than "unique."
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Post by Figgles on Aug 11, 2021 17:37:20 GMT
It is actually the seeing through of the idea of 'my' unique perspective in comparison to 'your' unique perspective that does away with the assertion that 'not knowing' relative to appearing people in the dream, equals "Solipsism."
Solipsism asserts a singular perceiver, whereas Nonduality asserts a 'singular/undivided' view/locus of seeing that is absent a perceiver.
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Post by Figgles on Aug 11, 2021 18:02:13 GMT
Perfect cap on this convo:
As self-identification with the body-mind
is the poison that brings bondage,
seek liberation by seeing that oneself is not
any thing personal or perceivable. - Niz
"senses"...as in "direct sense of self/me" IS a perceivable!
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Post by Figgles on Sept 10, 2021 23:39:00 GMT
You are erroneously equating an wholly "imaginary" entity/separate person with that which appears and thereby, designating them both to be "illusion."
Appearances DO appear. It's not an illusion that something appears...that there is experience arising. But "a separate person/entity" does not appear. Rather, it's imagined. It's false. That's what makes it an "illusion."
Yes, ego - ideas directly related to the appearing character/body/mind continues to arise/appear following SR...no big deal though because it's all now clearly seen for what it is....empty appearance only. There is no longer identification with any of it.
The important distinction inherent in seeing through separation is that between what appears vs. what exists/existence itself (they are one & the same...only one thing/thing-less thing that exists...all else arises ephemerally, not-separate from that, dependent upon, within/to that).
Nothing that appears has inherent existence in it's own own right. And again, an 'entity' per se (separate person) does not actually appear...it's imagined. Whereas a body/mind/character, and accompanying likes/dislikes, thoughts and ideas relative to that, DO appear.
When you designate all that appears AND erroneously imagined things that don't appear but are falsely believed to be appearing (mistaking a rope for a snake) to all be "illusive," you leave no room for waking up TO the dream....no room for continuing to dream while being fundamentally free from the shackles of the dream.
Your version of awakening means the dream itself must end.
The dream itself is not the 'prison.' It's mistaking the dream for actual/having inherent existence that = bondage to it. You do not need for the dream to end to be free from it.
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Post by Figgles on Sept 10, 2021 23:41:30 GMT
So you are done with this world but it seems the world is not yet done with roydop? How does that work? If you're wide awake to the Truth, what's up with the dream continuing on for you? As per what you are suggesting to be the Truth about this world, shouldn't it have all gone up in smoke already for you?
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Esponja
Super Duper Senior Member
Posts: 1,742
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Post by Esponja on Sept 11, 2021 1:19:34 GMT
You are erroneously equating an wholly "imaginary" entity/separate person with that which appears and thereby, designating them both to be "illusion." Appearances DO appear. It's not an illusion that something appears...that there is experience arising. But "a separate person/entity" does not appear. Rather, it's imagined. It's false. That's what makes it an "illusion." Yes, ego - ideas directly related to the appearing character/body/mind continues to arise/appear following SR...no big deal though because it's all now clearly seen for what it is....empty appearance only. There is no longer identification with any of it. The important distinction inherent in seeing through separation is that between what appears vs. what exists/existence itself (they are one & the same...only one thing/thing-less thing that exists...all else arises ephemerally, not-separate from that, dependent upon, within/to that). Nothing that appears has inherent existence in it's own own right. And again, an 'entity' per se (separate person) does not actually appear...it's imagined. Whereas a body/mind/character, and accompanying likes/dislikes, thoughts and ideas relative to that, DO appear. When you designate all that appears AND erroneously imagined things that don't appear but are falsely believed to be appearing (mistaking a rope for a snake) to all be "illusive," you leave no room for waking up TO the dream....no room for continuing to dream while being fundamentally free from the shackles of the dream. Your version of awakening means the dream itself must end. The dream itself is not the 'prison.' It's mistaking the dream for actual/having inherent existence that = bondage to it. You do not need for the dream to end to be free from it. Well written as always. Even the label dream is giving it depth. Life force. Belng. In the non-existant now. What dream? Who would even be there deciding if it ends? |
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Post by Figgles on Sept 11, 2021 22:28:39 GMT
I may be wrong, but seems to me what SDP is suggesting is not so far removed from your own suggestion to seekers to "attend to the actual."
Being conscious to what's actually going on (WIBIGO)...what is actually appearing here now, what's a mere imagining or surmising....what's an appearance only in relation to that which never changes...is important in terms of becoming a mature, human adult.
SDP, if you're reading along here...this is what i hear you saying. If so, I very much agree. While simply being more consciously aware to what's happening in the dream, in mind, is not the equivalent of awakening TO the dream, it is what's required to awaken to the consensus trance.
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Esponja
Super Duper Senior Member
Posts: 1,742
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Post by Esponja on Sept 11, 2021 23:28:04 GMT
I may be wrong, but seems to me what SDP is suggesting is not so far removed from your own suggestion to seekers to "attend to the actual." Being conscious to what's actually going on (WIBIGO)...what is actually appearing here now, what's a mere imagining or surmising....what's an appearance only in relation to that which never changes...is important in terms of becoming a mature, human adult. SDP, if you're reading along here...this is what i hear you saying. If so, I very much agree. While simply being more consciously aware to what's happening in the dream, in mind, is not the equivalent of awakening TO the dream, it is what's required to awaken to the consensus trance. when you say consensus trance, do you mean the current story line? |
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Post by Figgles on Sept 11, 2021 23:52:11 GMT
I may be wrong, but seems to me what SDP is suggesting is not so far removed from your own suggestion to seekers to "attend to the actual." Being conscious to what's actually going on (WIBIGO)...what is actually appearing here now, what's a mere imagining or surmising....what's an appearance only in relation to that which never changes...is important in terms of becoming a mature, human adult. SDP, if you're reading along here...this is what i hear you saying. If so, I very much agree. While simply being more consciously aware to what's happening in the dream, in mind, is not the equivalent of awakening TO the dream, it is what's required to awaken to the consensus trance. when you say consensus trance, do you mean the current story line? Not necessarily, no. Unless the story-line has beliefs inherent to it that are merely assumed/surmised.... not looked into....that remain, "un-examined." While both current story-line and consensus trance are 'in the dream' what I mean by consensus trance specifically, is the relatively speaking, 'false' ideas, generally bought into by those who don't look beyond the surface of things....the ideas/beliefs many take for granted without even bothering to question. |
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Esponja
Super Duper Senior Member
Posts: 1,742
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Post by Esponja on Sept 12, 2021 3:28:33 GMT
when you say consensus trance, do you mean the current story line? Not necessarily, no. Unless the story-line has beliefs inherent to it that are merely assumed/surmised.... not looked into....that remain, "un-examined." While both current story-line and consensus trance are 'in the dream' what I mean by consensus trance specifically, is the relatively speaking, 'false' ideas, generally bought into by those who don't look beyond the surface of things....the ideas/beliefs many take for granted without even bothering to question. Ok yes thought so, thanks for clarifying. |
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