Camouflage...?

You say you disagree with the 'commodification' of animals, but does actual compassion for the apparent fear, pain that animals experience play into that 'disagreement' at all?

If so, how do you resolve the fact that you know your actions are contributing to that, and that that makes you feel bad, and yet you do it anyway?

I really do not understand how absent an urge for the taste of meat, you would not simply take the kinder, more compassionate road. After all, you are the one who says he knows that animals are in fact, sentient and that they suffer.

How is your acquiescence towards the pull to contribute to inhumane animal treatment really any different from all those asshole folks you label as "Capitalists" going along with it? How do you know those who currently experience the pull towards greater acquisition of material goods, a bigger, better house, a mortgage that ensures a roof over their head for years to come, etc, etc, are not also just 'trusting in the bigger picture'?

If it's true that all of your actions are intuitively guided and you're cool with whatever urges arise, why are you so damned judgmental of others who do stuff you deem to be 'wrong'...stuff that you deem to stand in the way of the manifestation of your perfectly ordered utopia? Why the anarchy against the present system?

You can't have it both ways; I am intuitively guided in all my actions, even those that appear to be lacking in compassion, sensitivity or caring, but yet, I will stand in judgement of all those whom I deem to be acting in ways that are contrary to a compassionate world. You've got a serious hypocrisy operating there.

For God's sakes, this very exchange we're having about 'sensitivity' and my sharing about the diet I gravitate towards, is only happening because you asserted that my 'not knowing' about others, must necessarily result in a lack of sensitivity and caring about others.

You're the one now talking about ignoring the sense of discomfort, ignoring the value of kindness and caring over personal benefit, IF, you are intuitively guided to eat sentient beings.

So how far would you go in terms of behaving in ways that clearly bring pain to another if you felt you were intuitively guided to do so.

Your claim of 'intuition' is Bull shit. Imagine all the Catholic priests who could claim the same regarding their behavior.

You derive pleasure from eating meat, and that sense of pleasure is stronger than/overrides your compassion for the animals involved, thus, the pleasure wins out. Again, that's fine. You gotta own it though.

I've already explained all this but I will respond again. For a start, I don't believe that abusive Catholic priests follow intuitive guidance. It is my compassion for animals/vegetables that lead me to realize the wrongness of commodification. You don't understand why I would eat meat in the absence of a particular desire for meat, because you don't understand what it means to follow intuitive guidance (or divine flow).  There's no more pleasure for me in eating meat than there is in vegetables, I enjoy both when they are in front of me.  I trust that guidance wholly (I have no choice BUT to trust it). I know that most folks are NOT trusting divine guidance, because I know what it means TO trust divine guidance. Most folks place their faith in egocentric  interests rooted in false beliefs. However, I don't judge people anywhere near as much as I judge systems. People choose the way they choose, and think the way they think, because of the systems in place. I don't blame folks for their actions, but I will challenge systems and the beliefs that create those systems. Don't take my criticism of capitalism, and the tyranny of commodification as a personal attack on you. Yes, I know it seems to you that I am hypocritical, and I am hypocritical, but I am also okay with that hypocrisy, because I trust in the divine guidance, and the bigger picture. 

Yes, your not-knowing if others are human beings, or apparitions, or borgs, or whatever else you think they might be, does lead to insensitivity in my opinion. I see you demonstrating that massively in your choices. 

I go to the supermarket, and I pay attention to intuitive pull towards something. I look for a sense of congruence and resonance. Sometimes I might experience a preference for something, but if my arm won't reach up and take it off the shelf, it isn't taken. 

Are you familiar with kinesiology?  That's how choices are made, except that I don't have to muscle test everything. I'm sensitive enough to skip that step. 

I have seen in the last several months that you have very little reference for what it means to be surrendered to divine flow. I don't know how to explain that better to you, other than the way I am doing. I don't experience 'choice' in the way you do. I have also seen clearly in your semi right wing support of capitalism, that you start from the position that folks could make different choices to the ones they make. I start from the position that folks can only make the choice they ARE making. Now in my case, I experience that literally, and I trust in the divine flow of the action. Sure, that makes me a hypocrite at times. I'm okay with that. Sure, it means I experience cognitive dissonance at times. I'm okay with that. 

Do you know that from the moment you wake up, to the moment you go to bed, you are hurting the planet, hurting people, hurting animals? It's inevitable because everything we do involves commodification. Everything we do is from within capitalism, which is a system born out of false belief. Put the lights on in your house? Run the shower? Buy food? Use transport? Wear clothes? All of it is damaging. Hypocrisy is inevitable for those that speak out against the current system. 

But beyond this 'commodification' you take issue with, do you see wrongness in subjecting animals to the fear and pain they appear to experience prior to ending up on your plate?

You have argued for the fact of animal's suffering in the past. Has your stance on that changed?



I don't understand because you've also shared in the past that you love animals, love spending time with them, relate to them deeply and feel badly when you see them in pain or in fear.

How is it that your caring/compassion becomes a cool second to this intuition you speak of? Isn't a sense of 'this is wrong....I feel bad that I am causing a sentient being to experience pain' the most obvious form of what could be deemed 'intuition'?

If it really doesn't matter to you in terms of taste, why not simply acquiesce to the sense of not wanting to contribute to the pain/fear of sentient beings?



To someone looking on at you contributing to animal fear and pain through your diet choices, don't you think it likely appears as though YOU are placing your faith in egocentric interests rooted in false beliefs?

How dare you judge others or even the systems in place, when you yourself disregard the pain of animals raised for food, in favor of a supposed intuitive sense that somehow trumps your own sense of discomfort at doing so.



What choices? I think you think you know stuff about me, that you really don't.

You though, are the dude who speaks about how he can let his light shine fully in the midst of the animals he house-sits, but who then, has no problem consuming other apparently sentient beings, just like them, to fulfill some sense of 'following intuitive guidance' even though he would be just as happy eating fruit and veggies.

THAT, is clear evidence in my books of a certain degree of 'insensitivity'. If I am feeling compassion for the apparent plight of an animal, that sense of compassion is all the 'intuition' I require to behave accordingly. You on the other hand, ignore that and follow some deeper urging within you. yes, it does sound very much to me akin to the abusive Catholic priests and anyone else who selfishly follows his urges to hurt another, even though he says he knows it's wrong.

One thing I very much agree with AH on is this: To behave in a way that you personally judge to be bad or wrong, to ignore that and do it anyway, and then try to justify it through mental shenanigans, is the most detrimental thing a person can do to himself.