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Post by Figgles on Jun 11, 2017 3:50:44 GMT
While it can be tempting at times to do so, we're always going to come up somewhat short in our attempts to judge the alignment or lack thereof of others, through observing their manifestations.
The following exchange where Reefs from ST forum, speaks about his perceptions on Eckhart Tolle, is a stellar example of one taking their own personal judgements and conclusions to be truths regarding the emotional countenance of another....absent seeing that his own conditioning plays a large part in the conclusions he has come to:
(Notice how he states his opinion here as an unquestionable truth). While Tolle may not be doing what he does for the purpose of being in the lime-light, that does not mean that he necessarily dislikes that aspect of what he does. Reefs has concluded through observation that Tolle does not enjoy the lime-light, but really, he has no way of truly knowing this.
Here, he states a truth that would indeed apply IF, one were to dislike being in the lime-light, but were to take on a role that demanded that he put himself in that situation, anyway.
(And here, he expounds upon his main faulty assertion, attempting to give it more credence...all the while, seemingly oblivious to the fact that his mind is leading him down the garden path of story telling and assumption).
****
Reefs clearly does not understand the meaning of 'self evident,' as he uses the term here. His own bodily response would indeed apply if he were talking about a self evident truth, but not his observation of another's. Interesting (In case you are reading here Gopal), Reefs was the one who balked at the idea that the perceptive ability or lack thereof of another who appears to you, cannot be known for certain....he seems to think he can know stuff about another with certainty, simply by observing. A dangerous position on many counts.
Using the body language demonstrated by Tolle in the videos one can find on the internet, to arrive at a truth about his internal experience, in the anti-thesis of 'a self evident truth' Every bit of Reefs arrival at that assertion, is based upon his own personal judgments.
While Tolle can easily be seen to lean more to the side of introverted than extroverted, that does not mean that he is necessarily "stressed out" as he engages his public.
The art of reading body language is far more subtle than Reefs makes out. Yes, there are generalized behaviors that we can look to to denote the presence or absence of stress. It's important to note though that a degree of stress can also abide quite nicely alongside enjoyment. Physical existence itself contains a degree of resistance. To judge all resistance as bad, wrong or something to be done away with, is to add another of resistance to that which really is non-problematic.
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Post by Figgles on Jun 11, 2017 5:12:32 GMT
Similarly, it's been asserted that fatal cancer in the likes of teachers such as Niz and Ramana, definitively indicates the presence of resistance/absence of alignment with Source.
Along with this, a distinction has been drawn between SR and alignment (as spoke of by Abraham Hicks).
I agree, there is a difference; SR is an encompassing, permanent shift involving how life is seen and experienced thereafter, and alignment (in the words of AH) is a moment to moment thing. Being in alignment in one moment, does not necessarily mean you will be in alignment in the next, however, IF one realizes Self, the degree to which he can ever become "mis-aligned" with source, is plain and simply going to be limited.
AS such, a little bit of resistance should it arise, is no big deal. Life is not expected to conform perfectly with an idealized version of the world.
Alignment or lack thereof, is always best assessed through the presence of equanimity or lack thereof, in the one you are observing. That said, you will also to some degree be surmising as you look on in judgement in an effort to delineate that.
AS I said in my earlier post, it's tempting to look at the physical manifestations of others to assess where they're at, but really, that only tells you what has manifested, not how the one experiencing the appearance in form is reacting or responding to that manifestation, emotionally. That reaction or response is what really counts in terms of what kind of experience one is having.
It is possible to have cancer, even fatal cancer, or any other serious illness/disease, and still experience life as fundamentally 'perfect.'
And, I would say that seeing is part and parcel of SR.
Even those who are mostly in alignment are going to at times, experience the manifestation of circumstances that are on the surface of things, 'imperfect.'
I would imagine that in the big scheme of things, neither Niz nor Ramana had much resistance to the fact of their having cancer....it's the folks who themselves have deep resistance to the idea of such who make the big deal out of it.
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Post by Figgles on Jun 11, 2017 5:40:25 GMT
Hehe...It gets even better:
What Reefs is missing here is that one can be both a little out of his element/comfort zone in something he feels compelled to do, AND also in enjoyment, all at the same time. That's really what it means to be at peace. And any resistance that arises in that, is going to be seen and experienced as a-okay, which means it does not negatively impact one in any way that is "important" to him.
What Reefs seems to be suggesting is that if one feels compelled to do something that he finds somewhat challenging, he should ignore that interest for fear of experiencing some resistance.
A little resistance is not the end of the world...to live life from a place of avoiding anything that might produce resistance, would be to stagnate.
Found this video of Tolle....pure enjoyment there, if you ask me. Sure, his personality is more reserved than that of an extrovert, but doesn't mean he's not thoroughly enjoying himself:
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2017 13:34:33 GMT
Hehe...It gets even better: What Reefs is missing here is that one can be both a little out of his element/comfort zone in something he feels compelled to do, AND also in enjoyment, all at the same time. That's really what it means to be at peace. And any resistance that arises in that, is going to be seen and experienced as a-okay, which means it does not negatively impact one in any way that is "important" to him. What Reefs seems to be suggesting is that if one feels compelled to do something that he finds somewhat challenging, he should ignore that interest for fear of experiencing some resistance. A little resistance is not the end of the world...to live life from a place of avoiding anything that might produce resistance, would be to stagnate. Found this video of Tolle....pure enjoyment there, if you ask me. Sure, his personality is more reserved than that of an extrovert, but doesn't mean he's not thoroughly enjoying himself: Yeah, good post, figs. The way I relate to so called resistance is it's more like pushing out the so called boundaries. Of course there's going to be resistance. Brain patterns are changing and as a result uncoordinated movements of thought and mannerisms are becoming coordinated. As it's happening in time with regard to body/mind, it takes time. The Orchestrator knows this. Tolle does also. I sense Tolle has something flowing through him reefs is unable to touch. Passion. Stirring video!!  |
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Post by Figgles on Jun 11, 2017 17:02:14 GMT
Hehe...It gets even better: What Reefs is missing here is that one can be both a little out of his element/comfort zone in something he feels compelled to do, AND also in enjoyment, all at the same time. That's really what it means to be at peace. And any resistance that arises in that, is going to be seen and experienced as a-okay, which means it does not negatively impact one in any way that is "important" to him. What Reefs seems to be suggesting is that if one feels compelled to do something that he finds somewhat challenging, he should ignore that interest for fear of experiencing some resistance. A little resistance is not the end of the world...to live life from a place of avoiding anything that might produce resistance, would be to stagnate. Found this video of Tolle....pure enjoyment there, if you ask me. Sure, his personality is more reserved than that of an extrovert, but doesn't mean he's not thoroughly enjoying himself: Yeah, good post, figs. The way I relate to so called resistance is it's more like pushing out the so called boundaries. Of course there's going to be resistance. Brain patterns are changing and as a result uncoordinated movements of thought and mannerisms are becoming coordinated. As it's happening in time with regard to body/mind, it takes time. The Orchestrator knows this. Tolle does also. I sense Tolle has something flowing through him reefs is unable to touch. Passion. Stirring video!! Yes to all of that! Well said Ishy. Yes, no doubt you and I both see passion and enjoyment when we watch Tolle (something very different from what Reefs sees), which really just drives the point home that you can't know for certain about the emotional countenance of another, through observation. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2017 17:27:27 GMT
Yeah, good post, figs. The way I relate to so called resistance is it's more like pushing out the so called boundaries. Of course there's going to be resistance. Brain patterns are changing and as a result uncoordinated movements of thought and mannerisms are becoming coordinated. As it's happening in time with regard to body/mind, it takes time. The Orchestrator knows this. Tolle does also. I sense Tolle has something flowing through him reefs is unable to touch. Passion. Stirring video!! Yes to all of that! Well said Ishy. Yes, no doubt you and I both see passion and enjoyment when we watch Tolle (something very different from what Reefs sees), which really just drives the point home that you can't know for certain about the emotional countenance of another, through observation. Somethings cannot be resisted...  Oh my goodness! This is rich! A reefs post explaining the use acronyms and abbreviations at the spiritual teachers website. How’s that for fucking laziness? It’s as though he’s saying, “I’m too important to use my time unwisely, so here are the acronyms and abbreviations explained that you may encounter while reading my posts. I’m just going to label it for what it is- en·tro·py ˈentrəpē/ noun noun: entropy; plural noun: entropies; symbol: S 1. 1.
PHYSICS
a thermodynamic quantity representing the unavailability of a system's thermal energy for conversion into mechanical work, often interpreted as the degree of disorder or randomness in the system.
2. 2.
lack of order or predictability; gradual decline into disorder."a marketplace where entropy reigns supreme" 3. synonyms: 4 deterioration, degeneration, crumbling, decline, degradation, decomposition, breaking down, collapse; More Geezus, reefs. While you’re at it, why don’t you consider having one nostril sewn shut so you won’t be wasting any of the energy you have left? I feel like you might be ready for that. I mean, it’s not like you’re using Gutenberg’s printing press where you have to set type to create your posts. THE POSTList of common acronyms and abbreviations used on the forum
A-H - Abraham-Hicks
ATA - Attending The Actual
BK - Byron Katie
CC- Cosmic Consciousness Experience
DWAD - Distinction Without A Difference
ESA - Extreme Spiritual Arrogance
LOA - Law Of Attraction
LOO - Law Of Opposites
ME - Meister Eckhart
MMM - Monkey Mind Manual
ND - Non-duality
Niz - Nisargadatta Maharaj
OBE - Out Of Body Experience
SR - Self-Realization
TMT - Too Much Thinking
TPTPAU - The Peace That Passes All Understanding
TR - Truth-Realization
=================================
This list is obviously incomplete. So please add your suggestions below so that we can complete the list. I'm going to continuously update this post. Thank you!Okay, reefs….Thought I’d add a few of my own just for grins and giggles….. Just in case I ever pop in to see ya. When in Rome..... TJAS;TDHAH- The Jews are smart; they don’t have a hell. SADUC/DASFA- Spots are dots up close/dots are spots far away WYRYERHAALDOLA, DYSTCP?- When you rub your eyes really hard after a long day of listing acronyms, do you see that checkerboard pattern? JTROTU- Join the ranks of the unclean HB-WFF- Horn broke- watch for finger.  Signing off with a little bit of military parlance for reefs... ALPHA MIKE FOXTROT |
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Post by Figgles on Jun 11, 2017 23:40:55 GMT
Yes to all of that! Well said Ishy. Yes, no doubt you and I both see passion and enjoyment when we watch Tolle (something very different from what Reefs sees), which really just drives the point home that you can't know for certain about the emotional countenance of another, through observation. Somethings cannot be resisted... Oh my goodness! This is rich! A reefs post explaining the use acronyms and abbreviations at the spiritual teachers website. How’s that for fucking laziness? It’s as though he’s saying, “I’m too important to use my time unwisely, so here are the acronyms and abbreviations explained that you may encounter while reading my posts. I’m just going to label it for what it is- en·tro·py ˈentrəpē/ noun noun: entropy; plural noun: entropies; symbol: S 1. 1.
PHYSICS
a thermodynamic quantity representing the unavailability of a system's thermal energy for conversion into mechanical work, often interpreted as the degree of disorder or randomness in the system.
2. 2.
lack of order or predictability; gradual decline into disorder."a marketplace where entropy reigns supreme" 3. synonyms: 4 deterioration, degeneration, crumbling, decline, degradation, decomposition, breaking down, collapse; More Geezus, reefs. While you’re at it, why don’t you consider having one nostril sewn shut so you won’t be wasting any of the energy you have left? I feel like you might be ready for that. I mean, it’s not like you’re using Gutenberg’s printing press where you have to set type to create your posts. THE POSTList of common acronyms and abbreviations used on the forum
A-H - Abraham-Hicks
ATA - Attending The Actual
BK - Byron Katie
CC- Cosmic Consciousness Experience
DWAD - Distinction Without A Difference
ESA - Extreme Spiritual Arrogance
LOA - Law Of Attraction
LOO - Law Of Opposites
ME - Meister Eckhart
MMM - Monkey Mind Manual
ND - Non-duality
Niz - Nisargadatta Maharaj
OBE - Out Of Body Experience
SR - Self-Realization
TMT - Too Much Thinking
TPTPAU - The Peace That Passes All Understanding
TR - Truth-Realization
=================================
This list is obviously incomplete. So please add your suggestions below so that we can complete the list. I'm going to continuously update this post. Thank you!Okay, reefs….Thought I’d add a few of my own just for grins and giggles….. Just in case I ever pop in to see ya. When in Rome..... TJAS;TDHAH- The Jews are smart; they don’t have a hell. SADUC/DASFA- Spots are dots up close/dots are spots far away WYRYERHAALDOLA, DYSTCP?- When you rub your eyes really hard after a long day of listing acronyms, do you see that checkerboard pattern? JTROTU- Join the ranks of the unclean HB-WFF- Horn broke- watch for finger. Signing off with a little bit of military parlance for reefs... ALPHA MIKE FOXTROT  |
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Post by Figgles on Jun 12, 2017 3:02:00 GMT
A good AH video on this subject:
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Post by Deleted on Jun 12, 2017 14:38:14 GMT
While it can be tempting at times to do so, we're always going to come up somewhat short in our attempts to judge the alignment or lack thereof of others, through observing their manifestations. The following exchange where Reefs from ST forum, speaks about his perceptions on Eckhart Tolle, is a stellar example of one taking their own personal judgements and conclusions to be truths regarding the emotional countenance of another....absent seeing that his own conditioning plays a large part in the conclusions he has come to: (Notice how he states his opinion here as an unquestionable truth). While Tolle may not be doing what he does for the purpose of being in the lime-light, that does not mean that he necessarily dislikes that aspect of what he does. Reefs has concluded through observation that Tolle does not enjoy the lime-light, but really, he has no way of truly knowing this. Here, he states a truth that would indeed apply IF , one were to dislike being in the lime-light, but were to take on a role that demanded that he put himself in that situation, anyway. (And here, he expounds upon his main faulty assertion, attempting to give it more credence...all the while, seemingly oblivious to the fact that his mind is leading him down the garden path of story telling and assumption). **** Reefs clearly does not understand the meaning of 'self evident,' as he uses the term here. His own bodily response would indeed apply if he were talking about a self evident truth, but not his observation of another's. Interesting (In case you are reading here Gopal), Reefs was the one who balked at the idea that the perceptive ability or lack thereof of another who appears to you, cannot be known for certain....he seems to think he can know stuff about another with certainty, simply by observing. A dangerous position on many counts. Using the body language demonstrated by Tolle in the videos one can find on the internet, to arrive at a truth about his internal experience, in the anti-thesis of 'a self evident truth' Every bit of Reefs arrival at that assertion, is based upon his own personal judgments. While Tolle can easily be seen to lean more to the side of introverted than extroverted, that does not mean that he is necessarily "stressed out" as he engages his public. The art of reading body language is far more subtle than Reefs makes out. Yes, there are generalized behaviors that we can look to to denote the presence or absence of stress. It's important to note though that a degree of stress can also abide quite nicely alongside enjoyment. Physical existence itself contains a degree of resistance. To judge all resistance as bad, wrong or something to be done away with, is to add another of resistance to that which really is non-problematic. I don't care whatever Reefs says! The only reason is, He is just reading somewhere and vomiting there, no direct knowledge. So I don't want to comment on what Reefs says! |
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Post by Figgles on Jun 14, 2017 17:00:25 GMT
While it can be tempting at times to do so, we're always going to come up somewhat short in our attempts to judge the alignment or lack thereof of others, through observing their manifestations. The following exchange where Reefs from ST forum, speaks about his perceptions on Eckhart Tolle, is a stellar example of one taking their own personal judgements and conclusions to be truths regarding the emotional countenance of another....absent seeing that his own conditioning plays a large part in the conclusions he has come to: (Notice how he states his opinion here as an unquestionable truth). While Tolle may not be doing what he does for the purpose of being in the lime-light, that does not mean that he necessarily dislikes that aspect of what he does. Reefs has concluded through observation that Tolle does not enjoy the lime-light, but really, he has no way of truly knowing this. Here, he states a truth that would indeed apply IF , one were to dislike being in the lime-light, but were to take on a role that demanded that he put himself in that situation, anyway. (And here, he expounds upon his main faulty assertion, attempting to give it more credence...all the while, seemingly oblivious to the fact that his mind is leading him down the garden path of story telling and assumption). **** Reefs clearly does not understand the meaning of 'self evident,' as he uses the term here. His own bodily response would indeed apply if he were talking about a self evident truth, but not his observation of another's. Interesting (In case you are reading here Gopal), Reefs was the one who balked at the idea that the perceptive ability or lack thereof of another who appears to you, cannot be known for certain....he seems to think he can know stuff about another with certainty, simply by observing. A dangerous position on many counts. Using the body language demonstrated by Tolle in the videos one can find on the internet, to arrive at a truth about his internal experience, in the anti-thesis of 'a self evident truth' Every bit of Reefs arrival at that assertion, is based upon his own personal judgments. While Tolle can easily be seen to lean more to the side of introverted than extroverted, that does not mean that he is necessarily "stressed out" as he engages his public. The art of reading body language is far more subtle than Reefs makes out. Yes, there are generalized behaviors that we can look to to denote the presence or absence of stress. It's important to note though that a degree of stress can also abide quite nicely alongside enjoyment. Physical existence itself contains a degree of resistance. To judge all resistance as bad, wrong or something to be done away with, is to add another of resistance to that which really is non-problematic. I don't care whatever Reefs says! The only reason is, He is just reading somewhere and vomiting there, no direct knowledge. So I don't want to comment on what Reefs says! Yeah, I hear ya. Disregard the name. Reefs is not the only one who thinks he can observe the manifestations of others to denote with certainty the degree of their fight with life. There's always going to be some degree of resistance by the very fact that experience is happening. For those who are mostly in alignment, whose streams are flowing very fast, the smallest blip into resistance, has more profound consequences. What Reefs and the likes of him fail to understand also is that one who is mostly in alignment, is going to experience less resistance when something supposedly 'serious' does show up...... he is seeing a seriousness in a fatal cancer at the tail end of a reasonably long, sages life, because he himself is in strong resistance to the idea of cancer, that the sage is simply not seeing. When we look on in judgement at the manifestations of others, we see those manifestations with our own baggage about those happenings, intact. I'd be willing to be that Niz for one, did not attach much importance at all to the fact of his cancer. I'd be willing to bet he did not regard his cancer as 'a problem to be solved' or 'something gone horribly wrong.' And really, when we get right down to it, (an enjoyable experience vs. a not so enjoyable experience) those judgements 'about' what manifests, are everything. |
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