Esponja
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Posts: 1,742
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Post by Esponja on Jan 18, 2023 0:04:27 GMT
Yep thiswas the other one! I loved both but also had to go huh?  Say waaat?! I left comments on both, essentially saying that this seemed to be a new focus for her....conceding to mind far more than she ever did before....both got deleted within minutes.   You’re kidding! More tyranny! |
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Esponja
Super Duper Senior Member
Posts: 1,742
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Post by Esponja on Jan 18, 2023 0:07:23 GMT
I left comments on both, essentially saying that this seemed to be a new focus for her....conceding to mind far more than she ever did before....both got deleted within minutes. You’re kidding! More tyranny! Yep my message on her insta got deleted too. It wasn’t even anything bad. Has Anna turned into Reefs? |
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Esponja
Super Duper Senior Member
Posts: 1,742
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Post by Esponja on Jan 18, 2023 0:14:35 GMT
Anyhoo, Jac’s doing the same. It’s fine if they know…most people who find ‘home’ have been on an apparent spiritual path, no denying that either.
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Post by Figgles on Jan 18, 2023 2:11:20 GMT
You’re kidding! More tyranny! Yep my message on her insta got deleted too. It wasn’t even anything bad. Has Anna turned into Reefs?  wow, eh? Your's deleted too! I gotta say, I expected better from her...figured she'd graciously arise to the challenge and do it in a mature and civil way...perhaps holding her ground, but thoroughly explaining it as well. That's too bad. A missed opportunity as I see it...I used to absolutely love it when folks came to my website to challenge my views...i wrote a few scathing reviews of Jed Mckenna's books that did not go over very well and ended up having some really good convos as we hashed it all out.... |
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Post by Figgles on Jan 19, 2023 7:20:40 GMT
Yeah, really does seem as though there's been a shift in Anna Brown's view;
I think what @larianton1008 was getting at is that when the person hears that he's not actually a separate something, (which most DO take to be a rather 'bitter' message) fear and anger are often the responses because there is some tiny bit of recognition there and ego/mind rears up to try to keep itself relevant.
This idea she is now putting forth that there is only 'relative truth,' and no 'Absolute Truth,' and that each persons highest value fulfilled = Truth, is a complete divergence (not to mention nonsense!) from what she used to say not so long ago.... but apparently prior to that Nondual focus, she was really into LOA and New Age..that's where she started....so looks like perhaps she's done a strange sort of 'full-circle' where she's headed straight back to 1st mountain position.
I think that whole subject about folks feeling angry when they hear the Nondual/Truth message is an interesting one that deserves some airtime.
I think there is a certain auspiciousness in that....why would there be anger unless ego/mind felt itself threatened...? And to feel threatened, there'd have to be something within the message that to some degree, rang as true/valid.
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Esponja
Super Duper Senior Member
Posts: 1,742
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Post by Esponja on Jan 19, 2023 7:30:30 GMT
Yeah, really does seem as though there's been a shift in Anna Brown's view; I think what @larianton1008 was getting at is that when the person hears that he's not actually a separate something, (which most DO take to be a rather 'bitter' message) fear and anger are often the responses because there is some tiny bit of recognition there and ego/mind rears up to try to keep itself relevant. This idea she is now putting forth that there is only 'relative truth,' and no 'Absolute Truth,' and that each persons highest value fulfilled = Truth, is a complete divergence (not to mention nonsense!) from what she used to say not so long ago.... but apparently prior to that Nondual focus, she was really into LOA and New Age..that's where she started....so looks like perhaps she's done a strange sort of 'full-circle' where she's headed straight back to 1st mountain position. I think that whole subject about folks feeling angry when they hear the Nondual/Truth message is an interesting one that deserves some airtime. I think there is a certain auspiciousness in that....why would there be anger unless ego/mind felt itself threatened...? And to feel threatened, there'd have to be something within the message that to some degree, rang as true/valid. Yep. Who is feeling angry? Sneaky thoughts.. |
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Post by Figgles on Jan 19, 2023 7:48:06 GMT
Yeah, really does seem as though there's been a shift in Anna Brown's view; I think what @larianton1008 was getting at is that when the person hears that he's not actually a separate something, (which most DO take to be a rather 'bitter' message) fear and anger are often the responses because there is some tiny bit of recognition there and ego/mind rears up to try to keep itself relevant. This idea she is now putting forth that there is only 'relative truth,' and no 'Absolute Truth,' and that each persons highest value fulfilled = Truth, is a complete divergence (not to mention nonsense!) from what she used to say not so long ago.... but apparently prior to that Nondual focus, she was really into LOA and New Age..that's where she started....so looks like perhaps she's done a strange sort of 'full-circle' where she's headed straight back to 1st mountain position. I think that whole subject about folks feeling angry when they hear the Nondual/Truth message is an interesting one that deserves some airtime. I think there is a certain auspiciousness in that....why would there be anger unless ego/mind felt itself threatened...? And to feel threatened, there'd have to be something within the message that to some degree, rang as true/valid. Yep. Who is feeling angry? Sneaky thoughts.. What I recall & was so cool, and different from anyone I'd ever engaged with in that way, is that when you were right on the cusp, you didn't get angry at all....I recall being kind of astounded at that...you were clearly right at that cliff's edge, hanging by a thin thread...and you were not at all trying to dismiss any of it, but instead, completely 'leaning in'......not even ego rearing up to try to keep itself relevant. Very cool....I know I've told you that before, but it bears saying again. ...don't get to see that kind of pure sincerity very often. But yeah....what a great opportunity for some self inquiry. If/when there IS anger...and a few folks come to mind here... ...(but regardless, that really is par for the course when the seeker is still primarily still in the driver's seat), the perfect question really is; Who/what is angry...why is there anger.....what's at stake? What am I afraid of....what's pissing me off..? It's all about ego/mind's fear of getting kicked out of the driver's seat....or even worse, dying, becoming totally irrelevant...or disappearing all together...which really, is an erroneous/irrational fear....but the seeker does not know that from the position he's seeing from at that point. |
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Post by Figgles on Jan 19, 2023 18:20:07 GMT
It's an interesting thing; That "I got it/I lost it," dealy regarding the shift in seeing that is SR, that Adyashanti coined that term for in has latest book, references a shift back into the locus of seeing within the dream whereby there IS recognition that that shift has happened....that the primary locus of seeing that WAS beyond/prior to experience, is now right back there...once again, mired in the experiential/personal.
It's the 'feeling lousy again...feeling like I am a separate someone again,' that lies central to that recognition of "oh no, I've lost it,"... That recognition of falling back into the dream of limitation is pretty easy and straightforward to see when the sense of separation that was prior to the glimmer/temporary awakening is now back again, but it's less easy to see that there's been a shift back into personal locus of seeing as primary (lost it) when the sense of separation is far more subtle...when it's not a feeling of lack/loss/something amiss at all, but instead, a sense of being a sort of 'existent super human.'
A sense of being 'a fully empowered human who is in full control of all manifestations' is a pretty heady feeling, so it makes sense that a shift back into the personal, 'losing it,' might go unseen and might even get mistaken itself for evidence of transcendent seeing.
And really, herein lies the problem with even associating so called "positive" arising/falling 'personal feelings/emotions' with SR/being awake in the first place. It is plain and simply too easy to mistake high/heady, way up there on the emotional scale/high on the roller-coaster feelings with proof of seeing from beyond/prior to, for something it isn't...SR/wakefulness...freedom.....Sky high feelings should never be used as a litmus test for SR, either in yourself or in your observation of others....they are unreliable.
It's all about where seeing is happening from. In the shift that is SR, the personal viewpoint does not disappear, it's just that NOW, it is couched within the primary locus of seeing that is 'beyond/prior to' ALL appearance...all feelings...all circumstance....all experience.
Coaching folks towards the higher end of the emotional scale temporarily and then convincing them that THAT = transcendent seeing/wakefulness/SR and then calling those sessions "satasang"....calling that Nonduality....the apprehension of Truth is plain and simply, BS.
Bottom line, if the focus is upon making the person feel better, (and there is nothing at all wrong with that) we're talking Self help....perhaps New Age spirituality...psychology...perhaps an amalgamation of all of those....NOT Nonduality/Truth....It's important to be clear on that or we get so called Nonduality teachers mislabelling self-help/LOA coaching sessions as "satsang"...and folks even more confused than most already are about what is even meant by Nonduality/Truth.
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Post by Figgles on Jan 19, 2023 18:42:27 GMT
And important to add to that; The absence of feeling like an existent, powerful human creator that is in full control of his desired manifestations does NOT equal the presence of a feeling of being a powerless, bounded, limited human, that has no zero control....THAT I think is the point many who are not seeing clearly, get stuck on.
In the context of 'the human being/person,' it's a context leap to then start talking about 'personal feelings of being unlimited/all powerful...unbounded.'
The realization of absence of limitation....absence of unboundedness does not the get applied to the temporally appearing human being like that....an absence of a fundamental separation does not translate into the presence of relative/personal super-powers.
Similarly with the whole "I know for Absolute certain that It's all alive...conscious....every object/thing is having it's own unique experience" misconception... Those folks believe that in the absence of that absolute knowing, the world and all it's things is therefore experienced as being "dead....devoid of consciousness....devoid of life and vitality" which is of course a complete and utter nonsense. In terms of experience I'd say it's pretty much a given that in SR, there is a greater sense of an intelligence in play....aliveness...vitality, BUT all of that falls under the umbrella of "sense/experiential/quality/property," and does not erroneously get mistaken as fundamentally existent...Truth.
Looks like Anna Brown is either mistakingly or purposefully conflating the generally 'nice/positive/upper scale' feelings that tend to go hand in hand with SR, with transcendent seeing itself...the feelings are the experiential impacts of SR, not the proof of shift in locus of seeing...the 'proof' is in whether or not the person is deemed to be the Source of seeing...of feelings....of seeing....of doing, perceiving, experiencing....if so, there's been a shift back into the dream and dream-stuff is being mistaken for the actual.
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Esponja
Super Duper Senior Member
Posts: 1,742
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Post by Esponja on Jan 20, 2023 6:47:53 GMT
Yep. Who is feeling angry? Sneaky thoughts.. What I recall & was so cool, and different from anyone I'd ever engaged with in that way, is that when you were right on the cusp, you didn't get angry at all....I recall being kind of astounded at that...you were clearly right at that cliff's edge, hanging by a thin thread...and you were not at all trying to dismiss any of it, but instead, completely 'leaning in'......not even ego rearing up to try to keep itself relevant. Very cool....I know I've told you that before, but it bears saying again. ...don't get to see that kind of pure sincerity very often. But yeah....what a great opportunity for some self inquiry. If/when there IS anger...and a few folks come to mind here... ...(but regardless, that really is par for the course when the seeker is still primarily still in the driver's seat), the perfect question really is; Who/what is angry...why is there anger.....what's at stake? What am I afraid of....what's pissing me off..? It's all about ego/mind's fear of getting kicked out of the driver's seat....or even worse, dying, becoming totally irrelevant...or disappearing all together...which really, is an erroneous/irrational fear....but the seeker does not know that from the position he's seeing from at that point. Well I can’t take the credit. This had been apparently seeking for 10yrs and was extremely curious and grateful. Enquiring is the best and why Bryon Katie is so cool. |
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Say waaat?! 
