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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2020 15:37:11 GMT
No, Self realization is NOT a matter of 'faith' at all. Truth is beyond dispute, beyond question, beyond faith. According to vedanta, Sraddha (faith) is considered to be one of the mental qualifications for the gain of self-knowledge. However sraddha is not blind belief in something or someone, nor is it a belief in a theory or dogma,. There is a big difference between blind belief and sraddha, i.e. faith pending understanding. The meaning of the phrase ‘faith pending understanding’ implies that you will yourself one day recognize that what the Upanisads and the teacher and the teachings are pointing out is true. At that point one doesn’t need sraddha anymore because one has recognized the truth for oneself.
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Post by someNothing on Apr 16, 2020 15:42:36 GMT
Great Scotts! Welcome back, Mr. Satch.
Hope all is well on Kho Phi Phi and you have a hammock to take it all in.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2020 15:48:50 GMT
Great Scotts! Welcome back, Mr. Satch.
Hope all is well on Kho Phi Phi and you have a hammock to take it all in.
I hope you are well too! Kho Phi Phi is an island I can sometimes see on a clear day. I haven't been there for many years. I gather it doesn't look anything like it did in the movie Beach. Apparently it's become a bit of a garbage tip. Uncontrollable tourism does that and it seems the balance was more in favor of making money from tourism rather than preserving its natural beauty.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2020 16:12:14 GMT
Great Scotts! Welcome back, Mr. Satch. Hope all is well on Kho Phi Phi and you have a hammock to take it all in.
I hope you are well too! Kho Phi Phi is an island I can sometimes see on a clear day. I haven't been there for many years. I gather it doesn't look anything like it did in the movie Beach. Apparently it's become a bit of a garbage tip. Uncontrollable tourism does that and it seems the balance was more in favor of making money from tourism rather than preserving its natural beauty. yes, its better for a small select group of people to have it all to themselves! but hey, had ya'll invested in proven waste management techniques back then you could have averted the crisis now
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Post by someNothing on Apr 16, 2020 16:13:54 GMT
Great Scotts! Welcome back, Mr. Satch.
Hope all is well on Kho Phi Phi and you have a hammock to take it all in.
I hope you are well too! Kho Phi Phi is an island I can sometimes see on a clear day. I haven't been there for many years. I gather it doesn't look anything like it did in the movie Beach. Apparently it's become a bit of a garbage tip. Uncontrollable tourism does that and it seems the balance was more in favor of making money from tourism rather than preserving its natural beauty. Oh, sure. That was one of the reasons I stayed "on the road" as long as I could. I figured it was just a matter of time before everything got run over. I spent several extended stints down in Kho Tao and over on Kho Chang and Kho Mak (Cambodia side) in the early-mid 90s. They were the quieter places I could find at the time, but I can't imagine what has happened to them.
If you get a chance, make your way out to the Andaman Islands, but will likely need to travel through Kolkata or somewhere in Tamil Nadu. I took a boat back then... $20 for a four-day boat trip! Spent about a month poking around on different islands, which were pretty pristine outside key townships. There are even some local tribes still there, I believe. Anyway, something in the area.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2020 16:19:57 GMT
If you get a chance, make your way out to the Andaman Islands...... I sure will if I ever get out of this lockdown. I can't even drive out of my own subdistrict at the moment! 5 miles in any direction and I hit a police checkpoint.
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Post by someNothing on Apr 16, 2020 16:50:35 GMT
If you get a chance, make your way out to the Andaman Islands...... I sure will if I ever get out of this lock-down. I can't even drive out of my own subdistrict at the moment! 5 miles in any direction and I hit a police checkpoint. Yeah, in that case, they prolly wouldn't let you out to the Andamans at this time either...or anywhere else in India. Gopal says they're on lock-down, too. I do imagine that to be something of a logistical nightmare.
It probably doesn't help that you're a big burly farang, either.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2020 16:52:38 GMT
If you get a chance, make your way out to the Andaman Islands...... I sure will if I ever get out of this lockdown. I can't even drive out of my own subdistrict at the moment! 5 miles in any direction and I hit a police checkpoint. same here!
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Post by Figgles on Apr 16, 2020 17:02:47 GMT
Great point. That's why words like sincerity, honesty and earnestness are used instead of wants, needs and desires. If one want's to be free, that's great, but stop short of figuring out what that needs to look like. Would the absence of a split-mind suffice? Absence of a split-mind relative to what precisely? I agree with E that in terms of 'wants' a seekers want to be free is fine and dandy, so long as mind isn't defining what that is....and that's a long-shot considering the seeker is necessarily already involved in that want for freedom. The seeker's want to be free from suffering does not stand apart from the seeker itself, and where there is a seeker, there is always the want to gain or achieve something personally. So I would say that all 'wants' for freedom, awakening, enlightenment, generally go hand in hand with the want to gain something for the seeker. Now, If you're talking absence of a split-mind relative to the interest in unabashedly looking 'at' mind, yes, I would equate that with 'sincerity, honesty, earnestness' relative to looking at mind. But again, earnestness/sincerity to look at mind and to become conscious of mind's machinations is not the same thing as deeply wanting to become enlightened. The seeker has no grasp whatsoever, either conceptually OR realizationally, of what that really is.
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Post by Figgles on Apr 16, 2020 17:20:32 GMT
How do you know what you are seeking if you haven't found it? Precisely. The seeker/SVP thinks he is after 'what the sage has,' but he has no idea, because the sage doesn't actually 'have' anything....rather, there's just an absence of the seeker/SVP. I don't. If looking 'at' mind happens, it happens right here, right now. No 'process or plan' necessary. Where there is sincere interest to look/see into mind, it happens. Period. And becoming aware of mind's machinations does not guarantee awakening to the dream/SR/enlightenment (whichever label you choose). Transcendence of mind is not something the person 'does.' There are folks that have practiced for years and even despite being relatively conscious of mind's machinations, are still not awake to the dream. There are no bridges within the dream TO seeing beyond the dream. That transcendence lies beyond mind, often gets conflated with the idea that "Ignoring thought = transcendence of mind." The person cannnot DO transcendence. It happens when it happens...IF it happens. Folks would be far better off aiming for becoming more consciously aware as that actually makes for a better dream. Not a path to awakening. Just an apparent path to a more satisfying experience. Ultimately though, all paths collapse when cause/effect get seen through. But for seekers, it's fine to engage them in the idea of embarking upon a path/plan for betterment, so long as that's not being conflated with a path to enlightenment. (there is none). That's a common fallacy. There is no 'edging' out of the dream, or 'edging up to Truth.' Waking up is a complete and total paradigm shift.
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