Deleted
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Corono
Jan 15, 2022 19:27:03 GMT
Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2022 19:27:03 GMT
can you confirm this to be an accurate statement.. not anecdotally, but with hard facts You always wine 'bout 'em and shrug anyways, so, ain't worth the effort!  you could have just said "no" |
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Corono
Jan 15, 2022 19:28:22 GMT
Post by ghostofmuttley on Jan 15, 2022 19:28:22 GMT
Funny how these results differ so wildly from place to place, eh? The case count numbers have always been distorted by testing everyone who goes to the hospital, and then reporting it as a case regardless of if they even receive treatment for coronavirus. There is a financial incentive for it, the susceptibility of the PCR tests to false positives has been known all along and the CDC recommended against using them a while back now. It's been a krazy klown world for awhile now, one where trusting government or corporatist dependent sources of information is a mistake. |
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Corono
Jan 15, 2022 19:29:01 GMT
Post by ghostofmuttley on Jan 15, 2022 19:29:01 GMT
You always wine 'bout 'em and shrug anyways, so, ain't worth the effort!  you could have just said "no" Nah, ya' see, I could, but like I already said ...  |
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Andrew
Super Duper Senior Member
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Corono
Jan 15, 2022 19:31:33 GMT
Post by Andrew on Jan 15, 2022 19:31:33 GMT
Good thread here comparing different states (and countries), with conclusions. In America, I can actually believe the unvaccinated are spreading more, but not really because of the vaccine. More because the politics involved means that a certain segment of the population are neurotically fearful of being within 20 yards of another person, and another segment of the population are like 'I'll do what I want, let's hug right now!' In the UK, even before omnicron, there were statistics showing that in every age group over 30, the vaccinated were spreading more (though stats seem to be endlessly flawed these days). But we don't quite have the same political divide that you do, so attitude towards covid varies greatly whether jabbed or not. |
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Deleted
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Corono
Jan 15, 2022 21:47:53 GMT
Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2022 21:47:53 GMT
Good thread here comparing different states (and countries), with conclusions. In America, I can actually believe the unvaccinated are spreading more, but not really because of the vaccine. More because the politics involved means that a certain segment of the population are neurotically fearful of being within 20 yards of another person, and another segment of the population are like 'I'll do what I want, let's hug right now!' In the UK, even before omnicron, there were statistics showing that in every age group over 30, the vaccinated were spreading more (though stats seem to be endlessly flawed these days). But we don't quite have the same political divide that you do, so attitude towards covid varies greatly whether jabbed or not. Muttley's claim was "yer more likely to get Omnichron if yer jabbed", and I don't think the twitter thread answers that. But with 63% of the US fully vaxed it might make sense that the vaxed are spreading it more (only because of them being in greater number). In a perfect pandemic there would be the resolve to quarantine the infected and use contact tracing to re-trace their steps (which also would provide the researchers with more information to evaluate) But we didn't get that... we got a politicized event instead. |
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Andrew
Super Duper Senior Member
Posts: 8,345
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Post by Andrew on Jan 15, 2022 22:28:07 GMT
Good thread here comparing different states (and countries), with conclusions. In America, I can actually believe the unvaccinated are spreading more, but not really because of the vaccine. More because the politics involved means that a certain segment of the population are neurotically fearful of being within 20 yards of another person, and another segment of the population are like 'I'll do what I want, let's hug right now!' In the UK, even before omnicron, there were statistics showing that in every age group over 30, the vaccinated were spreading more (though stats seem to be endlessly flawed these days). But we don't quite have the same political divide that you do, so attitude towards covid varies greatly whether jabbed or not.
But with 63% of the US fully vaxed it might make sense that the vaxed are spreading it more (only because of them being in greater number). In a perfect pandemic there would be the resolve to quarantine the infected and use contact tracing to re-trace their steps (which also would provide the researchers with more information to evaluate) But we didn't get that... we got a politicized event instead. well...showing that conclusively one way or the other would be very tough, because of the factors involved. But the fact that it's hard to show says a lot about the limitations of the vax in controlling spread. It does help when stats take into account proportions of jabbed/unjabbed. Australia handled the pandemic in that perfect way, and in the end, couldn't stop the virus. The thing is that covid is a very interesting 'danger' level. It's dangerous enough to warrant caution and to call for restrictions, but not so dangerous that many folks want to hide under the bed for long. The ambiguous nature of the danger is the perfect context to create intense political division and to bring in 'track and trace' and 'vaccine passes'....a great many countries did take that route. In my view, you really should be thankful that you have avoided that horror mostly. Just saw this.... |
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Inavalan
Super Duper Senior Member
Posts: 1,608
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Corono
Jan 16, 2022 4:46:35 GMT
Post by Inavalan on Jan 16, 2022 4:46:35 GMT
Muttley's claim was "yer more likely to get Omnichron if yer jabbed", and I don't think the twitter thread answers that.
But with 63% of the US fully vaxed it might make sense that the vaxed are spreading it more (only because of them being in greater number). In a perfect pandemic there would be the resolve to quarantine the infected and use contact tracing to re-trace their steps (which also would provide the researchers with more information to evaluate) But we didn't get that... we got a politicized event instead. well...showing that conclusively one way or the other would be very tough, because of the factors involved. But the fact that it's hard to show says a lot about the limitations of the vax in controlling spread. It does help when stats take into account proportions of jabbed/unjabbed. Australia handled the pandemic in that perfect way, and in the end, couldn't stop the virus. The thing is that covid is a very interesting 'danger' level. It's dangerous enough to warrant caution and to call for restrictions, but not so dangerous that many folks want to hide under the bed for long. The ambiguous nature of the danger is the perfect context to create intense political division and to bring in 'track and trace' and 'vaccine passes'....a great many countries did take that route. In my view, you really should be thankful that you have avoided that horror mostly. Just saw this.... I feel sorry for these guys who found out that they've been duped. But, as long as they don't take any responsibility for their gullibility, they haven't learned anything. |
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Corono
Jan 16, 2022 10:07:22 GMT
Post by ghostofmuttley on Jan 16, 2022 10:07:22 GMT
ok. do-over. It would appear from your link that I was wrong about this, thanks for making the effort. My mind remains open on the topic. |
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Corono
Jan 16, 2022 10:13:00 GMT
Post by ghostofmuttley on Jan 16, 2022 10:13:00 GMT
Good thread here comparing different states (and countries), with conclusions. In America, I can actually believe the unvaccinated are spreading more, but not really because of the vaccine. More because the politics involved means that a certain segment of the population are neurotically fearful of being within 20 yards of another person, and another segment of the population are like 'I'll do what I want, let's hug right now!' In the UK, even before omnicron, there were statistics showing that in every age group over 30, the vaccinated were spreading more (though stats seem to be endlessly flawed these days). But we don't quite have the same political divide that you do, so attitude towards covid varies greatly whether jabbed or not. Muttley's claim was "yer more likely to get Omnichron if yer jabbed", and I don't think the twitter thread answers that. But with 63% of the US fully vaxed it might make sense that the vaxed are spreading it more (only because of them being in greater number). In a perfect pandemic there would be the resolve to quarantine the infected and use contact tracing to re-trace their steps (which also would provide the researchers with more information to evaluate) But we didn't get that... we got a politicized event instead. Quarantine and contact tracing are a high cost. Do you really think that the death rate for healthy people under 65 justifies the benefit? I don't. Might have made sense with some of the faked early estimates of death rates, but not sub .5%. Quarantine is essentially an arrest, and if you want to deprive people of their liberty then you have no choice but to politicize the event. |
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Post by ghostofmuttley on Jan 16, 2022 10:23:11 GMT
Good thread here comparing different states (and countries), with conclusions. In America, I can actually believe the unvaccinated are spreading more, but not really because of the vaccine. More because the politics involved means that a certain segment of the population are neurotically fearful of being within 20 yards of another person, and another segment of the population are like 'I'll do what I want, let's hug right now!' In the UK, even before omnicron, there were statistics showing that in every age group over 30, the vaccinated were spreading more (though stats seem to be endlessly flawed these days). But we don't quite have the same political divide that you do, so attitude towards covid varies greatly whether jabbed or not. Interesting theory as to the differential in the US stats with other's. Another possibility is that the American version of the hive mind is more efficient at generating fraud. If you go back and look at the thread on st from 2 years back, at one point the question came up as to why the death rates in NY were so high compared to CA. One of the reasons, as it turns out, was that Cuomo had panic'd and sent covid-19 patients into nursing homes to save bed space. That didn't come out until later.
At that time I was checking the all-cause-mortality numbers - especially for NYS - and that's what convinced me that the pandemic was a significant event, the spike in the all-cause mortality. Haven't gone back to look at those in detail since, but I have read reports that the leading cause of death in young people is now suicide. I find that rather shocking. Also, the mortality rates from overdoses have increased significantly.
My initial concern back then was in the cost/benefit of the policies they were proposing and enacting, and it would seem to me from my impression of the nth-hand informationscape that some of the worst of those concerns were quite justified. But, as time has gone on the agenda's and skill at generating propaganda of the sources of that nth-hand information have made it more and more difficult to form lucid impressions. Certainly, more difficult in the moment, and often with shocking validations of some of the darkest perspectives that happen after the dust settles.
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