Post by Figgles on Aug 31, 2018 21:44:33 GMT
Another interesting find on that thread - an old post of Andrew's...one I 'liked' and obviously agreed with at the time. I now very much agree with what Reefs said there....I wonder if he'd still agree with what he posted back then, though... 
Can now see,The bolded is where Andrew goes wrong; He is placing the physical appearance of new neural pathways as 'cause/catalyst' to the end of seeking, (and, practice as cause to new neural pathways!) when in actuality, 'new neural pathways/body-mind changes' are simply experiential arisings that 'correlate' with clarity/cessation of seeking.
The end of seeking is not a physical thing, as he says, rather, it's about the end of identification with physical things, including bodies, minds, and thus, of course, 'neural pathways' as absolute causes/catalsyts.
Reefs: No one deliberately chooses to become a seeker. The entire matter of picking up the search, driving the search and undoing the search is just not in your hands. The effort may have some effects in the relative realm, but cannot touch the absolute realm. That's why it doesn't matter in terms of self-realization.
Andrew:yep to the first but, that's why I said 'seekers gonna seek'. However I don't see the relative and absolute realms as separate. Yes, it's true in the broadest sense that self-realization is acausal and can therefore happen without practices. But the non-separate nature of the 'realms' means that practice may well have value....most of the teachers seem to think it does...whether it's self-enquiry, focusing on I am, ATA, meditation, questioning beliefs....
After all, we we are talking about is a physical thing. New neural pathways are formed, the body-mind develops a new way of experiencing/perceiving, conditioning is changed considerable. Practices can affect all those things. I would say at some point the boundary of practices has to be recognized, there may have to be a good dose of futility and frustration even....but that doesn't mean that the practices haven't served their purpose.
Read more: spiritualteachers.proboards.com/thread/4048/aka-practice?page=1#ixzz5PnIEeXjG
After all, we we are talking about is a physical thing. New neural pathways are formed, the body-mind develops a new way of experiencing/perceiving, conditioning is changed considerable. Practices can affect all those things. I would say at some point the boundary of practices has to be recognized, there may have to be a good dose of futility and frustration even....but that doesn't mean that the practices haven't served their purpose.
Read more: spiritualteachers.proboards.com/thread/4048/aka-practice?page=1#ixzz5PnIEeXjG
Can now see,The bolded is where Andrew goes wrong; He is placing the physical appearance of new neural pathways as 'cause/catalyst' to the end of seeking, (and, practice as cause to new neural pathways!) when in actuality, 'new neural pathways/body-mind changes' are simply experiential arisings that 'correlate' with clarity/cessation of seeking.
The end of seeking is not a physical thing, as he says, rather, it's about the end of identification with physical things, including bodies, minds, and thus, of course, 'neural pathways' as absolute causes/catalsyts.
