Esponja
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Post by Esponja on Apr 11, 2021 5:41:05 GMT
So interesting, someone just asked over on the Dr Joe Dispenza page, why everyone started his meditations. Someone answered that for years they followed Advaita Vedanta but had chronic illness and needed some tools.
His work is fascinating I have to say, people do appear to heal doing his meditations and certainly live in gratitude and become more conscious but yet you are told to meditate for hours daily and if you don’t heal you’re not doing it properly etc.
I guess I was a student of his for 2 years and have recently dropped all of my practises so I like to discuss it and observe others on that journey.
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Andrew
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Post by Andrew on Apr 11, 2021 11:43:20 GMT
I have thought, and maybe said a few times for a number of years, that advaita, non-duality etc offers a unique WAY of experiencing. It doesn't offer a 'state' or 'feeling', though in a sense, the 'way' of experiencing organically comes with certain states/feelings that are less available in other 'ways' of experiencing. I agree with the general consensus on the subject that there's nothing one can do to 'produce' or 'create' this way of experiencing, though realizations are integral (or 'correlated with' if that is softer), to this 'way'.
The tools are generally very compatible with this 'way' of experiencing, in fact, they are generally probably more compatible, because the absence of attachment and flexibility that the advaita 'way' offers, lends itself to using the tools effectively, and using the right tool for the job at hand.
I know what I said here isn't a conventional view, it's just my own view of things.
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Post by Figgles on Apr 11, 2021 19:44:54 GMT
I have thought, and maybe said a few times for a number of years, that advaita, non-duality etc offers a unique WAY of experiencing. It doesn't offer a 'state' or 'feeling', though in a sense, the 'way' of experiencing organically comes with certain states/feelings that are less available in other 'ways' of experiencing. I agree with the general consensus on the subject that there's nothing one can do to 'produce' or 'create' this way of experiencing, though realizations are integral (or 'correlated with' if that is softer), to this 'way'. Yeah, I can agree with that. The absence of an SVP does change the way the world is experienced...it's no longer something separate, objective, 'out there.' I'm not sure I'm understanding what you mean here. I would say though that while there is no substitute for realization/seeing through of separation, there are practices and tools people can use to experience a relative sense of freedom...a better dream....and as I always say, that's nothing at all to sneeze at!....but it's important to note that the relative experience of freedom goes hand in hand with the presence of certain thoughts/ideas, (even though in the presence of those thoughts, other, less allowing thoughts/ideas are not arising), whereas actual Freedom from the SVP = an absence. Period. It's a freedom that does not rely on thoughts at all. |
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Andrew
Super Duper Senior Member
Posts: 8,345
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Post by Andrew on Apr 11, 2021 20:32:19 GMT
I have thought, and maybe said a few times for a number of years, that advaita, non-duality etc offers a unique WAY of experiencing. It doesn't offer a 'state' or 'feeling', though in a sense, the 'way' of experiencing organically comes with certain states/feelings that are less available in other 'ways' of experiencing. I agree with the general consensus on the subject that there's nothing one can do to 'produce' or 'create' this way of experiencing, though realizations are integral (or 'correlated with' if that is softer), to this 'way'. Yeah, I can agree with that. The absence of an SVP does change the way the world is experienced...it's no longer something separate, objective, 'out there.' I'm not sure I'm understanding what you mean here. I would say though that while there is no substitute for realization/seeing through of separation, there are practices and tools people can use to experience a relative sense of freedom...a better dream....and as I always say, that's nothing at all to sneeze at!....but it's important to note that the relative experience of freedom goes hand in hand with the presence of certain thoughts/ideas, (even though in the presence of those thoughts, other, less allowing thoughts/ideas are not arising), whereas actual Freedom from the SVP = an absence. Period. It's a freedom that does not rely on thoughts at all. well, to give just one example, 'healing work' would be classed as a tool, as it is a 'doing' of sorts, and it can be done by anyone (if they are inclined). As it's a tool, there is a method, part of which is 'getting out of the way'. Because the advaita 'way' of experiencing is absent the SVP (using your words), then healing work would be very natural (not saying all advaitans want to do healing work, I guess it's a personality thing) |
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Post by Figgles on Apr 11, 2021 21:32:04 GMT
Yeah, I can agree with that. The absence of an SVP does change the way the world is experienced...it's no longer something separate, objective, 'out there.' I'm not sure I'm understanding what you mean here. I would say though that while there is no substitute for realization/seeing through of separation, there are practices and tools people can use to experience a relative sense of freedom...a better dream....and as I always say, that's nothing at all to sneeze at!....but it's important to note that the relative experience of freedom goes hand in hand with the presence of certain thoughts/ideas, (even though in the presence of those thoughts, other, less allowing thoughts/ideas are not arising), whereas actual Freedom from the SVP = an absence. Period. It's a freedom that does not rely on thoughts at all. well, to give just one example, 'healing work' would be classed as a tool, as it is a 'doing' of sorts, and it can be done by anyone (if they are inclined). As it's a tool, there is a method, part of which is 'getting out of the way'. Because the advaita 'way' of experiencing is absent the SVP (using your words), then healing work would be very natural (not saying all advaitans want to do healing work, I guess it's a personality thing) Except, there's a mind-game involved in practicing such a thing....in engaging in a process where the goal is to 'get out of the way' so that my personal desires will become manifest'... and usually in seeing that, the very impetus to engage in such processes, disappears. |
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Andrew
Super Duper Senior Member
Posts: 8,345
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Post by Andrew on Apr 11, 2021 22:24:10 GMT
well, to give just one example, 'healing work' would be classed as a tool, as it is a 'doing' of sorts, and it can be done by anyone (if they are inclined). As it's a tool, there is a method, part of which is 'getting out of the way'. Because the advaita 'way' of experiencing is absent the SVP (using your words), then healing work would be very natural (not saying all advaitans want to do healing work, I guess it's a personality thing) Except, there's a mind-game involved in practicing such a thing....in engaging in a process where the goal is to 'get out of the way' so that my personal desires will become manifest'... and usually in seeing that, the very impetus to engage in such processes, disappears. I'll leave it Fig, I felt like expressing something this morning, but it's not something I want to talk about really. But here's a happy tune I've been listening to tonight |
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Esponja
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Post by Esponja on Apr 11, 2021 23:03:39 GMT
Except, there's a mind-game involved in practicing such a thing....in engaging in a process where the goal is to 'get out of the way' so that my personal desires will become manifest'... and usually in seeing that, the very impetus to engage in such processes, disappears. I'll leave it Fig, I felt like expressing something this morning, but it's not something I want to talk about really. But here's a happy tune I've been listening to tonight I guess that’s why non-duality forums struggle. There’s always a pointing back to Truth and it kills off any other subject because it’s seen that it’s dream stuff and nothing wrong in it but non-duality isn’t about self-improvement as there’s nobody to improve anything. |
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Esponja
Super Duper Senior Member
Posts: 1,742
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Post by Esponja on Apr 11, 2021 23:07:14 GMT
I have thought, and maybe said a few times for a number of years, that advaita, non-duality etc offers a unique WAY of experiencing. It doesn't offer a 'state' or 'feeling', though in a sense, the 'way' of experiencing organically comes with certain states/feelings that are less available in other 'ways' of experiencing. I agree with the general consensus on the subject that there's nothing one can do to 'produce' or 'create' this way of experiencing, though realizations are integral (or 'correlated with' if that is softer), to this 'way'. The tools are generally very compatible with this 'way' of experiencing, in fact, they are generally probably more compatible, because the absence of attachment and flexibility that the advaita 'way' offers, lends itself to using the tools effectively, and using the right tool for the job at hand. I know what I said here isn't a conventional view, it's just my own view of things. I guess it’s not about a ‘view point’. It’s in dream, controller, a me trying to make things better because me is not whole and me is in lack. Or Truth/No svp... already all of it, and none of it.. part of the dream. For me, the person going back to Dr Joe’s work is because they didn’t get to this via Advaita Vedanta and feel in lack and ill so want a better dream. That’s so cool but they’ll always still feel in lack no matter how much you try to become ‘nobody, nowhere, nothing in notime’ there’s a someone trying to get there...it’s a game! A more creative one that’s all. Like playing monopoly. |
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