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Post by Deleted on May 18, 2019 17:28:41 GMT
How come? Becoming conscious means becoming aware of what's ACTUALLY happening. You are getting rid of your thoughts and bringing your focus to back of your eyelid. So what happens is, speed of thoughts are getting slow down so the gab between one thought and another started to increase so you started to feel a kind of peace. But thing you fail to notice here is, ZD's little guy is here and he is the one operating there. Everyone is aware of what's happening. How could you not be aware? You must be mistaken for something. In my experience mind is extremely tricky. It would hide under something which we usually miss out. One illusion goes another one comes but we are not even aware of the truth that we are in another illusion now. According to me, if mind is forming any conclusion in our experience as to why it's happening this way, that too is the problem I see.
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Post by Deleted on May 18, 2019 17:29:34 GMT
That's perfect. People those who are not aware of the creative aspect usually has fallen into the trap of meditation. You don't know what meditation is so how can you give an opinion? Yes, but I know consciousness and it's creative way so I know where you go wrong. You don't know reality is being imagined every moment.
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Post by Deleted on May 18, 2019 17:36:40 GMT
Everyone is aware of what's happening. How could you not be aware? You must be mistaken for something. In my experience mind is extremely tricky. It would hide under something which we usually miss out. One illusion goes another one comes but we are not even aware of the truth that we are in another illusion now. According to me, if mind is forming any conclusion in our experience as to why it's happening this way, that too is the problem I see. We are always aware. You told me a long time ago that you are a perceiver. Have you forgotten?
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Post by Deleted on May 18, 2019 17:37:42 GMT
You don't know what meditation is so how can you give an opinion? Yes, but I know consciousness and it's creative way so I know where you go wrong. You don't know reality is being imagined every moment. How can you go wrong by being conscious?
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Enigma
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Post by Enigma on May 18, 2019 23:29:09 GMT
It's possible, if one's practice is aimed at that goal. The only one who has described their practice in that way is Lolly. When there's talk about controlling and dismissing or obliterating mind, I know such a mediation will not lead to becoming conscious. I don't know what lolly has described. Meditation is to transcend mind and abide in the source which is non-dual awareness. That's how you become conscious because that's what you mean by it. I asked you to define what is becoming conscious a long time ago and you defined it for me as being established in awareness or knowing you are awareness so we were clear on that. However if you have since changed your mind and becoming conscious means something else then please tell me what it means and how you become conscious. Please give me as much detail as possible as to how one becomes conscious. What I have described is becoming conscious with this practice. However today you seem to think that this practice has something to do with control and a split mind so it cannot be what you told me in the past about becoming conscious. You need to clear up this confusion and tell me all you know about becoming conscious What needs to happen first is that an observer position is permanently taken such that one is always observing the mind and body. (A position on the river bank rather than in the river) From that position, it's relatively easy to become aware of what mind is doing on an unconscious level. One understands one's own motivations and fears and mind games. The result is that one lives consciously, with integrity and self honesty and sincerity. From that position as observer one is distanced from mind and it's machinations, and a turning toward Self in realization is far more likely. In a sense this may be called transcending mind and abiding in source, but I very much doubt that I would have said that as it would be a misdirection and just add confusion.
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Enigma
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Post by Enigma on May 18, 2019 23:39:26 GMT
You become conscious with meditation practice. How come? Becoming conscious means becoming aware of what's ACTUALLY happening. You are getting rid of your thoughts and bringing your focus to back of your eyelid. So what happens is, speed of thoughts are getting slow down so the gab between one thought and another started to increase so you started to feel a kind of peace. But thing you fail to notice here is, ZD's little guy is here and he is the one operating there. Yup, the little guy is still running the show from behind the curtain, and he's saying 'Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain'.
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Enigma
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Post by Enigma on May 18, 2019 23:42:30 GMT
How come? Becoming conscious means becoming aware of what's ACTUALLY happening. You are getting rid of your thoughts and bringing your focus to back of your eyelid. So what happens is, speed of thoughts are getting slow down so the gab between one thought and another started to increase so you started to feel a kind of peace. But thing you fail to notice here is, ZD's little guy is here and he is the one operating there. Everyone is aware of what's happening. How could you not be aware? You clearly need a meditation practice aimed at becoming conscious.
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Enigma
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Post by Enigma on May 18, 2019 23:46:48 GMT
You must be mistaken for something. In my experience mind is extremely tricky. It would hide under something which we usually miss out. One illusion goes another one comes but we are not even aware of the truth that we are in another illusion now. According to me, if mind is forming any conclusion in our experience as to why it's happening this way, that too is the problem I see. We are always aware. You told me a long time ago that you are a perceiver. Have you forgotten? He's not talking about being aware, he's talking about the content of awareness.
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2019 2:21:12 GMT
We are always aware. You told me a long time ago that you are a perceiver. Have you forgotten? He's not talking about being aware, he's talking about the content of awareness. I think you have forgotten all the past conversations from gopal about perceiving. For Gopal there is no such thing as awareness without perceiving. For Gopal that is awareness as the archive will show.
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2019 2:41:57 GMT
I don't know what lolly has described. Meditation is to transcend mind and abide in the source which is non-dual awareness. That's how you become conscious because that's what you mean by it. I asked you to define what is becoming conscious a long time ago and you defined it for me as being established in awareness or knowing you are awareness so we were clear on that. However if you have since changed your mind and becoming conscious means something else then please tell me what it means and how you become conscious. Please give me as much detail as possible as to how one becomes conscious. What I have described is becoming conscious with this practice. However today you seem to think that this practice has something to do with control and a split mind so it cannot be what you told me in the past about becoming conscious. You need to clear up this confusion and tell me all you know about becoming conscious What needs to happen first is that an observer position is permanently taken such that one is always observing the mind and body. (A position on the river bank rather than in the river) From that position, it's relatively easy to become aware of what mind is doing on an unconscious level. One understands one's own motivations and fears and mind games. The result is that one lives consciously, with integrity and self honesty and sincerity. From that position as observer one is distanced from mind and it's machinations, and a turning toward Self in realization is far more likely. In a sense this may be called transcending mind and abiding in source, but I very much doubt that I would have said that as it would be a misdirection and just add confusion. So you are talking about the practice of becoming the witnessing observer. It is simply not possible to do that and make it permanent as anyone can easily demonstrate within a few seconds Thoughts will always spontaneously arise and distract you away from that pure observing position. What you can do though is dip in and out of that position and that is what is done in practice. But this is where I have to profoundly disagree with you. Do you not see that if you put yourself in the position of the observer and then you speak about the observer understanding one's motivations and fears and what mind is doing on an unconscious level, that you are no longer the observer. You are now doing a lot of thinking about your motivations. There is no observer distancing himself from the mind while at the same time understanding motivations. This is a complete contradiction. This is not correct practice. Transcending mind means doing just that, not thinking about one's motivations or fears but becoming completely absorbed in silence, the infinite silence of awareness, pure awareness. and then plunging back into activity and bringing the value of that silence back into activity to integrate that infinite value into the limited value of experience in the field of action. That my friend is true practice which will yield meaningful and practical results. You must have had a lot of headaches trying to make your observer permanent.
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