Enigma
Super Duper Senior Member
Posts: 13,969
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Post by Enigma on Oct 6, 2019 2:22:42 GMT
spiritualteachers.proboards.com/post/209975What??? You mean no knowing about those appearing people as actually experiencing/perceiving? Seriously Reefs, in reading your past posts and beginning to wonder if perhaps your account was hi-jacked. Your position on so much of this has changed so dramatically. You'll come around to embracing my 'crossing universes' theory sooner or later....Now I'm starting to sound like Gopal!
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Enigma
Super Duper Senior Member
Posts: 13,969
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Post by Enigma on Oct 6, 2019 2:34:12 GMT
Well, I'm not sure he's saying his knowing is a matter of logic, though he does suggest using logic to satisfy the mind. As you suggest, it's flawful logic, which usually becomes flawful because mind is already biased toward a specific answer before logic is even employed. Sasquatch does this on a regular basis. This tells me that the flawful logic folks haven't actually realized anything that would clear up the conceptual issue and eliminate the bias. Can we agree that this is a forum about spirituality? Okay good. The goal therefore in the interest of this subject should be freedom, realization, and I'm here to tell you that it has nothing whatsoever to do with logic, flawful, unflawful or otherwise. It can be spoken about, pointed at, but as far as realization itself is concerned, there is nothing to say about it. Talking the non-duality talk is without value and a waste of time without the practice of going back to the source. If you want to be free then you have to completely destroy the mind. There is no Bliss with mind, there is only eternal Bliss when you have completely destroyed the mind or what you consider to be the mind which is actually a phantom. You have to become absolutely nothing to become everything. Then you can be free. You don't seem to be any nearer to this simple truth than when I first interacted with you a few years ago on ST. If you stay at this point, just playing your mental games you will not make any progress and you will be having the same conversations 10 years from now. I ask you in all seriousness - for what? I know. What I'm saying is that when peeps misuse logic due to a belief bias, it tells me there has been no realization.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2019 3:22:37 GMT
spiritualteachers.proboards.com/post/142386I could not have said it better myself; The 'aliveness' pointer is all about 'mindscape content,' about 'what' is seen, vs. 'how it is seen.' He knew this back in 2013.... what happened Reefs? That's the million dollar question. My opinion is that the new Reefs is from a parallel universe where he held some very different opinions, and a freak electrical storm caused him to shift into this reality. In actuality, he's really confused about his own apparent contradictions. New Reefs:D
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Post by Figgles on Oct 6, 2019 3:59:49 GMT
Enter in: The Almighty CC!! spiritualteachers.proboards.com/post/324585Interesting to note, that prior to this "CC introduction", Reefs had some pretty strong opinions about CC's as well as very firmly voiced assertions about precisely what constitutes a 'realization' and what does not. The posts that follow will focus upon these obvious contradictions. That's one of the problems with calling Awareness, Consciousness. Those who don't know better will objectify it and assume IT is conscious. While there is always Awareness, there isn't consciousness outside of form, and what we don't know is whether a given appearance (the actual nature of form) is conscious, since there's no law saying that all appearances occurring to a particular point of perception must be conscious. In two sentences, you've nailed it down.
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Post by Figgles on Oct 6, 2019 4:05:15 GMT
Well, I'm not sure he's saying his knowing is a matter of logic, though he does suggest using logic to satisfy the mind. As you suggest, it's flawful logic, which usually becomes flawful because mind is already biased toward a specific answer before logic is even employed. Sasquatch does this on a regular basis. This tells me that the flawful logic folks haven't actually realized anything that would clear up the conceptual issue and eliminate the bias. Can we agree that this is a forum about spirituality? Okay good. The goal therefore in the interest of this subject should be freedom, realization, and I'm here to tell you that it has nothing whatsoever to do with logic, flawful, unflawful or otherwise. It can be spoken about, pointed at, but as far as realization itself is concerned, there is nothing to say about it. Talking the non-duality talk is without value and a waste of time without the practice of going back to the source. If you want to be free then you have to completely destroy the mind. There is no Bliss with mind, there is only eternal Bliss when you have completely destroyed the mind or what you consider to be the mind which is actually a phantom. You have to become absolutely nothing to become everything. Then you can be free. You don't seem to be any nearer to this simple truth than when I first interacted with you a few years ago on ST. If you stay at this point, just playing your mental games you will not make any progress and you will be having the same conversations 10 years from now. I ask you in all seriousness - for what? Mind need not be destroyed, for freedom to be, just transcended. In transcendence, mind takes a back-seat to Being. Mind is not the enemy. What has E said that has you convinced he's playing mental games? you're the one advocating 'practice' after all....
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Post by Figgles on Oct 6, 2019 4:09:35 GMT
spiritualteachers.proboards.com/post/142386I could not have said it better myself; The 'aliveness' pointer is all about 'mindscape content,' about 'what' is seen, vs. 'how it is seen.' He knew this back in 2013.... what happened Reefs? That's the million dollar question. My opinion is that the new Reefs is from a parallel universe where he held some very different opinions, and a freak electrical storm caused him to shift into this reality. In actuality, he's really confused about his own apparent contradictions.
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Post by Figgles on Oct 6, 2019 4:10:29 GMT
spiritualteachers.proboards.com/post/209975What??? You mean no knowing about those appearing people as actually experiencing/perceiving? Seriously Reefs, in reading your past posts and beginning to wonder if perhaps your account was hi-jacked. Your position on so much of this has changed so dramatically. You'll come around to embracing my 'crossing universes' theory sooner or later....Now I'm starting to sound like Gopal!
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2019 4:20:42 GMT
Can we agree that this is a forum about spirituality? Okay good. The goal therefore in the interest of this subject should be freedom, realization, and I'm here to tell you that it has nothing whatsoever to do with logic, flawful, unflawful or otherwise. It can be spoken about, pointed at, but as far as realization itself is concerned, there is nothing to say about it. Talking the non-duality talk is without value and a waste of time without the practice of going back to the source. If you want to be free then you have to completely destroy the mind. There is no Bliss with mind, there is only eternal Bliss when you have completely destroyed the mind or what you consider to be the mind which is actually a phantom. You have to become absolutely nothing to become everything. Then you can be free. You don't seem to be any nearer to this simple truth than when I first interacted with you a few years ago on ST. If you stay at this point, just playing your mental games you will not make any progress and you will be having the same conversations 10 years from now. I ask you in all seriousness - for what? Mind need not be destroyed, for freedom to be, just transcended. In transcendence, mind takes a back-seat to Being. Mind is not the enemy. What has E said that has you convinced he's playing mental games? you're the one advocating 'practice' after all.... You have made the intellectual discrimination with conviction between unchanging and changing. It's a legitimate first step of self-examination, but you are stuck there and you are mistaking it for realization because there is no practice to have the direct experience. You are living this separation which you think is oneness and it is reflected in your compulsive obsession with affirming your own state and forcing others to prove to your satisfaction that they are also realized, which you are not. Without practice there is no integration because there is no abiding in the source which leads to the dissolution and destruction of ego which then becomes the totality of freedom as a living reality which cannot be spoken about. Your compulsive intellectual inquiry is a reflection of your own seeking and you are using this forum as a vehicle for it. You need to closely examine what you mean by sharing, because it is not that at all. Without practice you lack the direct experience of the transcendent which is your true nature. Your resistance to practice is based on misconceived ideas about the limited self and your own misunderstood ideas about non-duality. There are no ideas about nonduality, only the experience of the nondual. Although awakening can happen spontaneously, for most, practice is essential. The sages and the scriptures have affirmed this. Why do you resist?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2019 12:06:28 GMT
Well, I'm not sure he's saying his knowing is a matter of logic, though he does suggest using logic to satisfy the mind. As you suggest, it's flawful logic, which usually becomes flawful because mind is already biased toward a specific answer before logic is even employed. Sasquatch does this on a regular basis. This tells me that the flawful logic folks haven't actually realized anything that would clear up the conceptual issue and eliminate the bias. Can we agree that this is a forum about spirituality? Okay good. The goal therefore in the interest of this subject should be freedom, realization, and I'm here to tell you that it has nothing whatsoever to do with logic, flawful, unflawful or otherwise. It can be spoken about, pointed at, but as far as realization itself is concerned, there is nothing to say about it. Talking the non-duality talk is without value and a waste of time without the practice of going back to the source. If you want to be free then you have to completely destroy the mind. There is no Bliss with mind, there is only eternal Bliss when you have completely destroyed the mind or what you consider to be the mind which is actually a phantom. You have to become absolutely nothing to become everything. Then you can be free. You don't seem to be any nearer to this simple truth than when I first interacted with you a few years ago on ST. If you stay at this point, just playing your mental games you will not make any progress and you will be having the same conversations 10 years from now. I ask you in all seriousness - for what? Bullshit!
Q: How can the mind be made to go? Ramana: No attempt should be made to destroy it. To think or wish is in itself a thought. If the thinker is sought, the thoughts will disappear. Q: Will they disappear by themselves? It seems so difficult. Ramana: They will disappear because they are unreal. The idea of difficulty is itself an obstacle to realization. It must be overcome. To remain as the Self is not difficult. This thought of difficulty is the chief obstacle. A little practice in discovering the source of 'I' will make you think differently. Absolute freedom from thoughts is the state conducive to such recognition of the Self. Mind is but an aggregate of thoughts. ~ Ramana Maharshi
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2019 12:12:52 GMT
Can we agree that this is a forum about spirituality? Okay good. The goal therefore in the interest of this subject should be freedom, realization, and I'm here to tell you that it has nothing whatsoever to do with logic, flawful, unflawful or otherwise. It can be spoken about, pointed at, but as far as realization itself is concerned, there is nothing to say about it. Talking the non-duality talk is without value and a waste of time without the practice of going back to the source. If you want to be free then you have to completely destroy the mind. There is no Bliss with mind, there is only eternal Bliss when you have completely destroyed the mind or what you consider to be the mind which is actually a phantom. You have to become absolutely nothing to become everything. Then you can be free. You don't seem to be any nearer to this simple truth than when I first interacted with you a few years ago on ST. If you stay at this point, just playing your mental games you will not make any progress and you will be having the same conversations 10 years from now. I ask you in all seriousness - for what? Bullshit!
Q: How can the mind be made to go? Ramana: No attempt should be made to destroy it. To think or wish is in itself a thought. If the thinker is sought, the thoughts will disappear. Q: Will they disappear by themselves? It seems so difficult. Ramana: They will disappear because they are unreal. The idea of difficulty is itself an obstacle to realization. It must be overcome. To remain as the Self is not difficult. This thought of difficulty is the chief obstacle. A little practice in discovering the source of 'I' will make you think differently. Absolute freedom from thoughts is the state conducive to such recognition of the Self. Mind is but an aggregate of thoughts. ~ Ramana Maharshi
Well at least you didn't talk about f****** golf! "the jiva, which is in bondage through mental identification with the body, etc., should put forth effort in the form of reflection on the Self in a gradual and sustained manner; and when thus the mind gets destroyed, the jiva would become the Self." Ramana Maharshi
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